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Forum: SfP Development & Design
Thread: SfP II Wish List
Post by: Polare(30557)
2005-02-01 15:12:09
This thread is for people to put down what they would like out of an SfP II. Imagine that SfP were torn down and rebuilt. What do you like from the current game? What do you wish were dropped or changed?

But before getting into specifics ("I think Alliance Buildings should have 8.2 guards per member of the Alliance"), please put down your overall vision of Strive for Power II. Big plots? More interaction between parties or less? Deep character development with stats?

For me... I think the idea of a true war of Good vs Evil vs Neutral as outlined in the other thread is a great one. I'd love to be given a plot to "go get the Amulet of Yendor before the Good party gets it" while a Good party gets the same quest at the same time. See who can get to it first, even if you don't directly fight each other. I like the concept of direct interaction both between members of the same "faction" and members of enemy "factions".

I enjoy the deep character development of SfP. I hate math but I love numbers, go figure. Juggling my items so my ranger gets that extra shot in combat is fun. Experimenting to see whether STR or END gets me more results is interesting and keeps me involved. Maybe I'm crazy that way, but I like the broad swath of skills and stats.

Now to more specific things... If the faction plots are implemented, give players the ability to set up ambushes or encounters. Maybe the King of Darkness gives me control of 20 legions of Dark Elves to place as guards around the Orb of Smoogling, which a Good party has been given a quest to retrieve. Make there be advantages to positioning them correctly -- if I set up my archers 2 squares away and they're guarded by the pikemen 1 square away, and I manage to get the enemy party to flee, I'd think that's pretty cool. Likewise, if I manage to go on a quest with another Evil party that's logged on, we can "tag-team" the enemy setups and split the reward from the quest.

As it is, nobody ever uses anything but a single weapon type. That's rather silly. Give us bonuses for using the right weapon in the right circumstance -- if we're facing armored knights we better hope we have high skill with maces and war hammers, while a good sword skill will be much more useful against swarms of weak opponents. That's the kind of depth I want to see.

I can think of more but this is probably long enough already, so I'll chime in again later :)
Post by: Infamous_Infants(23)
2005-02-01 21:42:00
ohhh I got my own wish list :)
(SfP, II Wish List)

sorry about that..

Post by: raynbow(16237)
2005-02-01 22:34:26
My biggest wish is that it maintains the things we love about SfP. :)
Post by: Omen(10371)
2005-02-02 01:03:25
Man...you're lucky, II! You got to have your own wish list... Is it to honor your birthday? If I'm as lucky as II, I would like to have the same wish as Rayne...I also like the ideas that people contributed in the thread under this one. So, I don't know. To be hunted is fun, but to create a new party kills it. I just want to log in, kill monsters, get strong, collect potions, and log off.

Post by: gatcholio(28366)
2005-02-02 05:17:23
I have a concern regarding monsters that don't respawn, ie. plot pertaining monsters.

This seems to be great for those that start when the game begins, but it doesn't make it newb friendly for others later on. Imagine the disappointment when you have just became a donating player, only to find out that all the story line creatures are dead.

At that point, the game would become what it is now. A big vast area of constantly regenerating creatures with no plot points at all.
Post by: Doug the Designer(55)
2005-02-02 22:29:57
gatchholio: The bad guys can respawn plot bosses.
Post by: Doug the Designer(55)
2005-02-02 22:39:23
I want different spell types to mean something. Fire does 2x to the undead, ice does 2x to fire, etc. As it is now, an iceball is the same as a fireball.
Post by: raynbow(16237)
2005-02-03 04:59:17
I think having different spells affect different guys would be great, it would make the combat settings alot more tactical.

Also, I think one of the balance problems stems from the balance of magical and quest items.

It's way too hard to get magic items and quest items at the beginning, and way too easy at the end.

The basic magic items need to start showing up with greater frequency at the early levels, when people need them, and stop showing up so much on the higher level critters where they aren't needed.

Same with quest items. The spawning should be changed. Right now, the longer a dungeon has been unexplore the more items stack up. That means that one turn through a NW dungeon might give you 8 items, but 8 turns through the goblin caves might not give you one item. Cap how many items can be in a dungeon at one time max. Crank that number up a little bit for the lower level dungeons, and then turn down the power of the lower level named items.

For a brand new player being able to tool through the goblin caves and the kobold caves and then turn in quest items and get an item that is +5 to 2 stats would be pretty great.

I guess overall I'm just saying, make there a greater variety to the rewards so that rewards fit the level of the player finding them.
Post by: FloriZeus(7923)
2005-02-03 18:46:33
Okay I have some more ideas...some of them strange, others strange, but most just plain insane. Anyway here they are.

Besides the idea of the different Alignment and Sides(Good, Neutral, Evil), I like the thought of entering more politics and diplomacy by having factions within the sides. There would be several functions in the game, like a chosen Ruler of the Alignment(not for Neutral ofcourse;), eg the Good King and the Evil Warlord or something like that, he would need to be chosen by the other parties. Votes would be based on a certain Fame or Reputation mainly earned in the war against the other side either by killing their Armies/Monsters(=creatures), completing thus plot points or by harming their parties and retreiving stolen items. Also, for example by refounding razed cities or distorted dungeons. Besides such an overall ruler, there could maybe be some sort of Town Major, chosen by the Parties based in that time(as Home town or maybe as alliance town, or both) and later on with cities razed a new major would clearly be the one who rebuilds such a city. Yet on the dark side, I have no equivalent yet. Should be something like Dungeon Keepers maybe. Thus for this elections based on fame in their side, this is a fair thing. It rewards active parties that do much and yet an inactive leader will be quickly replaced(we could install that after three weeks of rule, any other party of the Side can call for elections). Entering this feature will cause for factions within the Sides itself, possibly parties will cluster into alliances and try to gain the power to direct their side in the War.
Things leaders could do is rebuild fallen strongholds(cities, dungeons, but maybe also fortresses). They could maybe enlist armies to fight in a bigger war and direct them to where they want to strike. Expenses would be financed by taxation within the side, probably every party having to give up 20-25 % of their income(not for Neutrals). Even doing so, the options given to the Leader could be made available for other players, yet at higher costs and lower efficiency.
All this to increase the Strive for Power within the Side yet on a plane of politics of some sort.

Not at any time would members of the same side be allowed to attack parties of their side nor armies nor cities. But there would be ofcourse be the possibility to kill good creatures. Why? You'll see later in my monologue.

This above brings me to my second point: basing alignement on Choice, on words, but basing reputation(not the same as fame) on action. I mean, is for every creature they kill or attack, a party get a notoriety of some sort. Killing good creatures decreases reputation, killing evil ones, increases it(eg killing a Elf would maybe decrease your reputation with 25, killing a Unicorn decrease it with 500, killing a Balrog increase it with 3000, mere figures- bad examples). Before being able to join Good or Evil, a party would maybe have to reach a certain reputation(eg 200 for Good and -200 for Evil). This would not be difficult to reach, and be some sort of proof of the heart. Yet when this first requirements would not be fulfilled anymore, the party would not be expelled automatically(eg, a new party starting; kills 200 orcs, joins the good side, and starts killing Hobbits all over the world, his reputation drops enormously, while he cannot be attacked by anyone of the Good; yet in return he cannot attack them, nor cities or armies) this is something useful, and tricky; again increasing the Strive within factions. Someone like this could be expelled by a party council though(same as for electing a leader, a single party can call forth this Council for different purposes thus).

That's it for now =) more will come later.
Post by: Doug the Designer(55)
2005-02-03 22:02:54
Fame or notoriety will work much as you describe I think. If you want faction leaders, they should also be able to banish parties from the faction. Banishing has a material expense based on the fame or notoriety of the party to be banished. Banished parties become neutral, unless they are "embraced" by a faction (works the same as banishing). In the case of embracing, it is possible that the embraced party will be responsible for repaying the material costs of their inclusion. PKing parties in your own faction will always be allowed. While this would have serious social consequences in the Good faction, Evil tends to be violent, and such things may even be encouraged from time to time (much cheaper to punish a wavering party than to banish them).

About quest items: I am of the opinion that the starting amount of magic items are just right, and that there are far too many later on. I think the copious amount of magic items is one think that breaks the game at the high levels. Putting high level items in low level boards will make things worse, because high level parties will just camp there to get the items, depriving low level parties of managable dungeons.
Post by: raynbow(16237)
2005-02-03 22:59:00
I never said to put high level items in low level dungeons. I said to put a few more low level items there, because the very low levels are the only time anyone uses the normal (not named) magic items. Once people start to get named items, they never use the "normal" magic items again. So make those normal items a little more prevalent for the people who WILL use them.

When I was a starting party, I only got one or two "normal" magic items before I started getting named items and decided trying to find the normal magic items wasn't worth the time. Right now, the normal magic items are just junk. The only time anyone uses them is when one of us gets bored and sets up a sale to the newbies.

And as for quest items. Again, I didn't say to put high level items in the low level dungeons. I said make low level quest items available in the low level dungeons with just a little bit more frequency. And make the low level items lower in level. Like make items you get from doing quests for Floggy and the Gnolls produce lower power items than they currently do, but make the items just a little bit easier to find.

Also, the most important thing is to make it so that the amount of time since a dungeon was last cleared has nothing to do with the chance of finding quest items inside.

And for heavens sake, reduce the amount of stuff on the dragon. It's insane. In one dragon kill you get more magic items than clearing all of Merinvar, and by the point your'e killing the dragon, they're all items that aren't worth using. The only reason anyone goes there is for potions anymore.

Post by: TrickytotheMaximus(8206)
2005-02-04 06:14:04
I say put all the high level items you want on the board, but make it so we can't equip them until certain skills are high enough. That will help with trade.

Not only are the weapons and armor traded, but if I need to get my strength high enough to use my new sword, I will also be looking for items to increase my strength. And I will be looking for items to improve Bless Strength on my healer. And so on and so on.
Post by: FloriZeus(7923)
2005-02-04 10:40:31
This makes it difficult, what if you equip an item with a certain strength requirement while undere the effect of a Bless strength spell? When this spell runs out, is the item unequipped or does it just remain equipped?
Post by: Wolverine(1)
2005-02-07 22:51:24
This is a very good idea.

Keep the ideas flowing.

Post by: TrickytotheMaximus(8206)
2005-02-08 01:29:23
Here are 3 ways to go:

1 auto un-equip (better be paying attention, lest you run around the dungeon half naked, or without your favorite sword).

2 leave it on. You managed to squeeze it on once, so you get to keep the benefit. If you take it off, you have to go get the skills back up to re-equip.

3 leave it on, but reduce the effectiveness of the item. This is my personal favorite, but might be tricky to implement.
Post by: Kubala(25078)
2005-02-13 14:14:34
If at all possible I would like some sort of option where my party can do its own thing without me. Sort of set rules of engagement and let it run. That's pretty much my role in the party anyway. All I did was set rules and go click click click. Wish I didn't HAVE to be there for the click click click part.

I'm also for there being more aspects to the game than just kicking evil butt. Politics, economics, technology (being able to "invent" skills and build custom weapons). I've always wanted to build custom named weapons. With that comes party members that are armorers. More than 5 races pretty much. 20+ races perhaps.

Plot's ok I suppose, but I'd like it to be more of a sandbox where you don't have to be hld down to certan tasking. I like having the option to do whatever whenever.

One thing's for sure, I'd like for it to be a bit more social. Not VOW social where you need someone online at the moment to play though.

I was talking about having a party go autonomous, and I think I've gotten a sort of idea from other people's ideas. In the AB, having the training room, with hourly AF type combat so that you can train while not actively playing. Perhaps have it so that it costs 10 (or whatever slightly insignificant number) APs to participate. Now no need to buy training, because the members can train each other. You do the bulk of gaining skills and practicing in the AB, and go out to make use of them.

How about having the ability to combine partys for a grand assault on the REALLY big bad boss. Are we to be solo adventurers on the quest to kill archflavious alone, or a part of a great team? Can I have my party specialize as being a corps of archers, knowing that mastering those skills will help my team mate who specializes in axemanship at the front lines of the battle?

It would be nice if it wasn't all or nothing to where you could possibly have 300k aps going down the drain. Not nessecarially AF where you walk it off for 24 hours and you're good to go, but certanly not all or nothing. Just a thought.
Post by: raynbow(16237)
2005-02-14 23:21:48
One of my favorite parts of MMORPG's is crafting. I wouldn't mind seeing crafting.

Mobs could drop some basic raw materials (it doesnt have to be as developed as crafting in a MMORPG) that you could use to create items based on your skill.

Some kind of enchanting would be especially cool, since normal items really aren't that important. Make it a combination of components and practice. Like you have to kill a ton of stuff to get the 'silver dust' that you need. And even after that you have to practice the skill in order to make better items.
Post by: Schelos(67924)
2005-03-09 12:13:05
I'd like to offer my 2 cents as well. There are several topics I'd like to discuss:

1- Magic Item Distribution and Effectiveness.
As was stated before, low level magic items are rare in the beginning, where they are needed, and plenty in the last stages, where they are useless.
I agree there should be a correction in the generation algoritmus. 1 Chief in each of the basic dungeons should have a magic item as treasure. If not possible, there should be another creature from each type created with magical treasure(Goblin King, Orc Warlord, Lizard Dragonspawn, Kobold Hero).
Dragon treasure should be changed as well. Less low level magic, maybe a few QIs, lots more money. People who fight the dragon are already loaded with Named Items, and will need cash in the NW.

2- Named Item Customization.
I have a very good idea on the matter, and I believe it would be relatively easy to program it. I'll expand it further if there is interest.
Sufice to say, it is worth it to get a less powerfull Named Item, if it fills exactly the equipment place you have waiting for it.

3- Plots, Quests, Stories, Good x Evil.
Keep the basic plot as it is. Archflavius is the bad guy and people must defeat him or join him (or die!).
Divide the OW map in 2 parts: good & evil (as it was said evil races were created and expanded territory). Shuffle the cities a bit. Players kill bad guys, get fame. Players kill good guys, loose fame (get infamous = negative fame).
Good monsters hostile to evil parties, evil monsters hostile to good parties.
Make everyone start in a certain city (say ... Farmer's Delight ... or "Adventure Fame") and explore around. Also, in this first city, they get a one-time quest, if they want to. Go into the nearest dungeon (Kobold Cave - as I said, shuffle the cities around...)and rescue the Farmer's Daughter (new QI). Reward is a low level magic weapon or armor (not named). We would need a "flag system" to work here. The quest is accepted, a flag is set. The daughter appears in a specific group in the next respawn. Only flagged players can attack it, and only for 24 hours. When the daughter is found, another flag is set for that player, so that the Quest is no longer available.
There are other ideas too. If you guys want to hear more of them, just say the word.

4- Changes in Classes
I have some changes to suggest for Fighters, Healers, Rangers, Rogues, and even mages.
Post by: fatboi(88277)
2005-05-04 23:14:25
one change, have the number of items listed NEXT to the item you are transferring
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