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Forum: VOW Development & Design
Thread: Chat rules discussions
Post by: yar(35506)
2008-02-25 21:29:26
(carried over from the mod discussion) anyone have a better description?

rule #1
no Offensive behavior:

You will not post anything that incites, advocates, or expresses pornography, nudity, obscenity, vulgarity, profanity, hatred, bigotry, racism, or verbal abuse in chat.

Now I am sure someone can say it better but I wanted to get the ball rolling.
Post by: denzil(82151)
2008-02-26 05:26:33
Not me i struggle to spell sheep! it seems clear to me. Well done. Any other thoughts on this guy's?
Post by: Dyna Mike Duncan(127082)
2008-02-26 05:54:10
I'd add a footnote that this includes words that are masked or the use of acronyms that include swear words.

(I'd also suggest that examples be quoted to highlight what masking/acronyms means so that it is clear to everybody. As long as players don't use these examples as an excuse to do it themselves or to accuse the Mods of breaking their own rules anyway)
Post by: Dyna Mike Duncan(127082)
2008-02-26 06:08:16
The only Rules people currently see when they log-in are as follows:

One account per person only.
No bad language or behavior.
No account or password sharing.
No selling/gifting accounts.

If it isn't possible/practical to automatically direct new LAW wrestlers to a more detailed explanation of the rules, then can't a 5th line be added saying something like:

For a more detailed explanation of the rules, go to http:/ etc etc

(once the detailed rules are amended anyway)
Post by: yar(35506)
2008-02-26 06:12:25
I was going to go through each of the rules but that seems alot of work when the only people reading these post already know the rules lol
Post by: Dyna Mike Duncan(127082)
2008-02-26 06:30:59
That's exactly why I think either an automated view of the rules for new LAWS or a link to the rules on the sign-in screen is definitely needed.



I was thinking of coming at it from a different perspective - look at the main reasons why people are losing their chat/getting suspended and highlight the rules around those areas.



From my experience, the major reasons for chat bans are:



Abuse/causing offense in chat

Spamming chat - multiple posts of the same/similar message, blank posts, nonsensical posts etc.

Arguments

Posting links to non-Plit sites

Offensive wrestler names/descriptions on profiles.



Main reason for full suspension is multi-accounting



Look at the problems - find the solution :)
Post by: yar(35506)
2008-02-26 06:37:50
Ya I agree good idea John.
Post by: denzil(82151)
2008-02-26 07:54:28
you know John your right. How ever i think its a good idea to run threw each of the rules so Peter can see what rules need amending or fixing so there is no misunderstanding with players. I think Ray was all so on the right track. Good job lads. Keep up the good work and i really hope Peter gets to read this fully. What your doing is awesome.
Post by: Dyna Mike Duncan(127082)
2008-02-26 07:59:31
The other side of this debate has to be how specific the rules are made - make them too vague and we get back to the current situation of different interpretations etc, make them too specific and players will come up with arguments like the woman who sued the manufacturer of her microwave because it didn't specifically say she couldn't dry her pet poodle in it!

As long as the 'spirit' of the rules are clearly identified, there shouldn't be a problem though.
Post by: tbragu(97303)
2008-02-26 08:27:29
I hope this will help. I remember a good bit of all the riles. And if nothing else, people can see them here, and if needed, Peter can look at it and ammend.

1. No offensive behavior

This includes but is not limited to the following:
Swearing, blatantly sexual language, racist and sexist terms, attacking other players in chat, and arguments.
Also included would be acronyms for swear words and sayings of the like

2. No spamming

Repeated posting of the same message(usually considered to be four straight posts).
Constant posting of periods or other exclamations.
Taking over the chat pane with repeated posts in a short time.

3. No links in chat to non-plit sites.
This includes e-feds, other games, and sites in general.

I hope this helps a bit. Being here nearly three years, those have always been the basic chat rules.


Post by: yar(35506)
2008-02-26 09:45:26
Actualy when I was a mod spam was 3 or more unmeaningful post in a short period of time, maybe that definition has changed.
Post by: tbragu(97303)
2008-02-26 09:50:41
Hey, in three years, I can forget a thing or two Ray, lol.
Post by: yar(35506)
2008-02-26 09:54:58
I believe i have forgot more than a thing or two:)
Post by: yar(35506)
2008-02-26 10:00:14
Lets not forget no personal attacks. this should be clear enough on it's own.
The question comes in though what about RPing or joking? My stance is a personal attack no matter how it is done is a personal attack. We cant expect the mods to sit back and try to figure out if it was meant offensively or not.
I think arguing also falls under this as well.
Post by: yar(35506)
2008-02-26 10:20:31
Players may not do anything to intentionally further another player's position if it significantly weakens their own position.

This is a very vague rule that not very many people understand. With the no noob bashing rule it may not even be needed anymore that much.

Except for people who make accounts to just feed other accounts. I think this rule comes into play when one character fights another one and doesnt heal obviously just feeding the other account untill that character dies from injury. What do you guys think?
Post by: Dyna Mike Duncan(127082)
2008-02-26 10:34:45
The last one is a really tough one to enforce and has been a real bone of contention in the past. Personally, I think fighting the same person multiple times with no chance of winning, just to help them advance/earn cash is a very grey area. Examples of this being:

Player A (SPWA) - Creates 10 Cage/LMS Matches against Player B, leaving no AP for autoheal

Player B: (SSWO) - Accepts all 10 matches + wins all but the first in one move!

Both Players earn a lot of cash, take very little stat damage. Dodgy tactic in my view - breaks the 'may not do anything to intentionally further another player's position' part of the rule, but not the second part.

Another example similar to the above, but Player A is about to detach + uses all his AP up on ONE opponent (maybe a Stable Mate) and then donates his cash to the stable beofre detaching. Again, this is furthering his opponent's position - but it happens a lot.

Neither of these examples breaks the rule as it is currently written, so they are legal tactics - just very dodgy to me :)
Post by: Dyna Mike Duncan(127082)
2008-02-26 10:48:05
It's also needs to be made clear that the Chat Rules also apply to Messages, Challenges/Acceptances (on VOW), Player Names + Profiles etc.
Post by: yar(35506)
2008-02-26 10:50:13
Well John maybe it doesnt break the whole rule, but possably breaks this rule Abusing bugs or unintentional game features, I could see it as abusing a game feature that was'nt set up or intended for people to have a series of matchs when one is just feeding the other. But the hard part might be proving the other knew.
For instance I sent a bunch of tag matchs to another player, when he accepted he didnt have the Ap to heal all of them but accepted anyway, which I had no control over, i probably wont do tag matchs with him again cause it did seem dodgy, but thats why the rule is hare to prove.
Post by: Dyna Mike Duncan(127082)
2008-02-26 11:06:48
I'd have never looked at that rule in that way before - shows how different interpretations of the current rules can cause issues.

Post by: yar(35506)
2008-02-26 11:12:05
rules can be twisted to fit alot problems lol. There should be a rule that if a mod tells you to stop doing what ever it is against the rule not to comply:)
Post by: Dyna Mike Duncan(127082)
2008-02-26 12:17:12
To be honest, as long as the rules are made clear + visible to everybody from the start (well, starting now anyway :P) then it will make things a whole lot easier for the players to follow them and the Mods to enforce them.

The rule breakers will have no comebacks when they are punished (not legitimate ones anyway) and it should minimise the complaints.

The punishments imposed - well that's a different kettle of fish altogether.

Assuming for now that punishments won't be automated for some time, then the current procedure will have to remain.

My suggestion would be:

Minor, first time offences (non-malicious spam/links in chat)- chat reinstated once the Mods receive the necessary e-mail from the player banned (providing it contains the necessary information and isn't abusive)

Secondary/mid-level offences (deliberate/malicious spam/arguing/minor insults)- 1 or 2 day chat ban from the time the e-mail is received by the mods

Tertiary/Serious Offences (LAW bashing once outside LAW/major insults) - 1 week chat ban from time the e-mail is received.

Further Rule Infringements - One Month Chat Ban!

LAST STRAW!!! - If the player still hasn't learnt to follow the rules by this stage, then they shouldn't be allowed their chat back at all.

This is an escalation of punishments - much like points on a driving license. After a certain amount of time with no more offenses being recorded, the first offense is stricken from the record etc etc
Post by: The Legend Killer(21778)
2008-02-26 13:10:08
**Warning - Long Post**

OK, so why don't we take the current Conduct & Privacy and rework it to something like this? It should cover most if not all of the rules within the games.

----

PLIT Games Conduct & Privacy

Contents **the following may be links**:
1. Account possession
2. Chat suspensions
2a. Game specific rules
3. Account suspensions
3a. Game specific rules
4. Forum conduct
5. Reporting to the moderators
6. Reclaiming accounts or chat
7. Privacy Statement and Legal Disclaimer

Pretext
Thank you for your interest in PLIT Games. Our aim is to ensure that you receive the best gaming experience in a safe and comfortable environment.


1. Account possession
Only one master account is allowed per player.
If you are found to be in possession of two or more master accounts, these accounts will all be banned and your access to the PLIT Games blocked.

Each master account allows you to possess the following:
1 wrestler in Virtual Online Wrestling;
1 party in Strive for Power;
1 empire in Space Conquest;
1 gang in each Gang War game;
Unlimited adventures in Adventures Fame.

Upon voluntary donation to PLIT Games, you may possess the following extra accounts:
2 extra wrestlers in Virtual Online Wrestling (3 total)
1 extra party in Strive for Power (2 total)
1 empire in Space Conquest Tournament

Players will also receive bonuses corresponding to the games they have accounts for, for more information, please see the Donations link.

If two players wish to play with separate accounts on the same computer, they must both e-mail the moderators at PLITGames@gmail.com. However, the accounts should in no ways interact; however, exceptions can be made by the moderators at PLITGames@gmail.com.

Accounts are not to be shared or “gifted” to another person. If you do not wish to play the games any more, then under no circumstances should you give your password to anybody else.

2. Chat suspensions
Please be aware that people from all backgrounds participate in PLIT Games. Everybody is entitled to have their own view and opinion; however, there may be some comments which may be deemed unsuitable for an open audience. If a moderator deems your chat behaviour inappropriate, your chat access will be blocked without any prior warning. Engaging in any of the actions below may result in your chat access being blocked:

* Offensive/threatening behaviour
* Offensive/threatening account names
* Inappropriate language **
* Masking inappropriate language **
* Advertising/linking to other sites outside of PLIT Games
* Spamming the chat (repeated posts over a short period of time)

Players are reminded to act in a polite and mature manner. Roleplaying is encouraged in appropriate mediums, however, if a chat moderator deems your roleplaying excessive or inappropriate, your chat access may be blocked without warning. Every player who accesses PLIT Games has the right to use the chat, regardless of their status within the game.

** Rules marked by this symbol are under the discression of the moderators. What you may see as being appropriate might not be appropriate to a moderator.


2a. Game specific rules
***Insert game specific rules here if we need them***


3. Account suspensions
More severe rule breaking may result in the loss of your account. Engaging in any of the following actions may result in the loss of your account:

* Possession of two or more accounts
* Farming accounts (using one account to improve the position of another)
* Abusing new players
* Advertising/linking to other sites outside of PLIT Games
* Using software which automatically reloads or accesses the games

Please note, that if your account is suspended, you are not entitled to a refund of your donation.


3a. Game specific rules
***As before***

4. Forum conduct
The forums within PLIT Games also follow the same rules as anywhere else within the site. Inappropriate threads and posts will be removed or edited if necessary. If persistent rule breaking occurs in the forum, your access to post may be removed.


5. Reporting to the moderators
If you see a rule being broken, then please e-mail the moderators at PLITGames@gmail.com. Please ensure that you provide suitable evidence such as screenshots and chat extracts. If sending private messages, then please send media from all parties involved, as this may help to speed up your report and will also ensure that a fair and unbiased decision is reached.


6. Reclaiming accounts or chat
If you are found to have broken the rules, you can reclaim your chat or account by e-mailing the moderators at PLITGames@gmail.com. Each case is taken upon its own merit, however, should you be found to have broken the rules regularly, the actions taken upon you may be more severe. It is the responsibility of suspended players to email the moderators so that the violation can be discussed. The length of the suspension (up to and including a permanent ban) will then be determined at the discression of the moderators.

When e-mailing the moderators, please ensure that you send the following information:
Master Account Name
Master Account Number

Please note, that if the following information is not clearly displayed, your case may be ignored or may take longer to resolve. E-mails are generally looked at every day, and although you may not get a response, the appropriate action may be taken, provided you have provided the correct details.


7. Privacy Statement and Legal Disclaimer
Plit.Dk agrees not to give or sell any of your personal information, including your name and email address, to any external web sites or non-game personnel without your permission. However, Plit.Dk does not control the information that you provide to any external sites that link to Plit.Dk. Please see the terms and conditions on their respective web pages.

Plit.Dk uses cookies for game-session tracking only, and this information is used solely by Plit.Dk.

Any e-mails, files, or other documents sent to or received by Plit.Dk, and any Plit.Dk chat room and forum records, become the sole property of Plit.Dk. All donations and payments made to Plit.Dk are final and non-refundable.

Please be aware that players bear full and exclusive legal responsibility for any content they post on Plit.Dk web pages, chat rooms or forums.

Finally, while Plit.Dk hopes to make all our gaming experiences enjoyable, we are not liable for ANY direct or indirect harm that may occur as a result of our games.

PLIT Games has the right to change these rules at any time.


Enjoy the games
Peter
Post by: yar(35506)
2008-02-26 17:27:38
Rock on LK very nice.:)
Post by: tbragu(97303)
2008-02-27 09:21:38
Impressive Ben. Here is another, and I don't mean this as a slight to anyone at all.


No one player has any more right to play or chat in PLIT than any other player or players.
Post by: yar(35506)
2008-02-27 11:02:26
True Mike, I might add as long as it is done within the confines of plit rules:)
Post by: The Legend Killer(21778)
2008-02-27 12:17:02
SfP bug was fixed about a year ago so all donators could have two parties. The only "bug" was that when you ran out of donation time, all your AP would be reduced to 5,000AP.
Post by: Craig(170136)
2008-02-27 16:45:22
No one player has any more right to play or chat in PLIT than any other player or players.

Please speak for yourself "i am vows gift sent from heaven"

People who know me should realise i've had countless chat bans. some may say i do it for the hell of it, others say i do it to try get others banned from vow, but i do like to think i've changed in the last few months.

The reason for this is because of the harsh punishments via the mods, my opinion is the mods are to nice, 2 day...4 day bans, come on what sort of chat ban is that lets be honest? that just gives the players time to gather aps, my last chat ban/vow suspension was for a few weeks, then i came to my sense and told myself to quit it, nobody on vow is worth me losing my account.

So what i'm getting at is the following, first ban for any player fair enough unless its just stupid (example;- spamming chat with swear words) then they should get a 24 hour ban, after that bigger chat bans should be brought in, and i'm not talking 2 days more like weeks.

Look how quite chat was without Will (joke)
Post by: denzil(82151)
2008-02-28 10:36:11
The deal is you have to do as the owner asks. follow his rule set as a mod and set the ban to what Peter wants. Some times you just have to make a call on a pain in the ass player. yep week or month banns. On one accashion i was told if the two players in question get in trouble there both gone for 1 year. That was a big call for Peter. One left any way and the other is still flotting arond some where. I think it was more the mass complaints allways coming in from them with the lies etc. if they both just grew up and shut there traps and stayed out of trouble there would have been no problem. its been nice with out them for the last year or more. just learing to take some responsabilaty for your self is a big start. as well as learning to shut your trap so it does not get you a ban too. so many people bite and get introuble at the same time.

So its fixed cool. sfp. it was something i ment to ask him if he fixed but allways forgot.

so you boys drawing up a table with what is light middle and your out of here type of ban?
Post by: Captain Stupendous(38517)
2008-03-01 00:46:17
I personally don't have a problem with the rules as they are written, since most of them are universal and can be found with little alteration on any other online browser-based game. The problem lies within getting people to actually read the rules. I honestly didn't read the rules either until after I got busted for multi-abuse. After that suspension ended (it ended QUICKLY, by the way, since I wasn't a jerk to the mods), I never broke a rule again because after reading the rules I finally knew what the guidelines of behavior were.

Here's an idea:
Before each login, pose a random True/False rule-related question that must be answered correctly before allowing access to PLIT Games. It's just one extra step that will use numbing repetition to drill the rules into every player's head.

The mandatory questions will end after... oh... let's just say 1000 logins.

----------------

Captain Stupendous' idea above is truly stupendous. True or False?
Post by: legendary wolf(38655)
2008-03-01 00:54:01
True, seconded.
Post by: denzil(82151)
2008-03-03 05:15:15
write it in stone and then have the questions writen up so peter can just do a cut and paist and i bet he might maybe doe it. lol am i sure yes sorta.
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