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Forum: VOW Development & Design
Thread: I know it won't happen but I'm bored
Post by: Deadman Inc(93629)
2007-01-18 16:28:00
why can't we just get rid of the stat cap and have a GOD League instead of being forced to retire like myself, who's worked on my char for 2 years and then have to just retire like BA. I mean c'mon I'm not a donator and I don't want to go through that buy buy buy craze again, I mean people had a choice to fight the gods but being godlike was taken away, that's why after I retire I'm not playing anymore because of some stupid stat cap :( make a god league make it to where you can't challenge VWO and below like SPWA-VWO where you can't challenge LAWS, let the gods be bored with no matches lol, but yeah I know it won't happen anyway.
Post by: Coneman(325)
2007-01-18 19:28:44
Like your thinking.. like 7.5k above can be GOD or somethin..

But tourneys would rarely run and you'd be struggling to find more matches..
Post by: Syrjis(80123)
2007-01-18 20:27:01
Cone, tourneys are rarely fun anyway and you're struggling to find match(es) anyways..
Post by: denzil(82151)
2007-01-19 02:11:59
thats why there should be some npc chars for old vets to playagainst. yes a god legue where your stats dont drop off and so on. now if this happens . well its not gona be me that tells BA. hell no. some one else do it as well as rvd and others. the only one what would say yes would be kish.

Denzil
Post by: The Mad Hatter(237592)
2007-01-19 09:38:53
Wow, that sounds like a real good idea.

Especially if it's not required, just if you want to.
Post by: Bret Hart(73101)
2007-01-19 23:11:04
I like it, because I remember when BA was really high up there... It was fun to fight him, and even funner to beat him! The thrill of defeating someone triple your exp is gone. :(
Post by: Captain Stupendous(38517)
2007-01-20 03:16:35
If you want to fight God, fight Joker. He's managed to accumulate 13 specials and has maintained a consistent winning record despite the stat cap/aging. Rikishi, despite his depleted stats, can hand out a good butt-kicking as well.

The introduction of the stat cap and aging protected the balance of the game and prevented people from being selfish. What other reason would drive people to want limitless power aside from SELFISHNESS?
Post by: yadlow2005(86957)
2007-01-20 10:06:51
*smiles* good point Captain..:)
Post by: Syrjis(80123)
2007-01-21 03:47:14
Single:
Brian Allan(17178) Wins: 12
Rikishi(36320) Wins: 5


Aah... the joys of fluking wins from BA... Gone :/ *sigh*

Capt, I dunno but I think that my 13 specials + PG strength bonus thingy (?) could have something to do with that ^^ *Cough* Spec 14 is on it's way
Post by: denzil(82151)
2007-01-21 11:09:08
well i see this in a two fold formate. the new league. the gods of V.O.W league.

league 1 is where the 5 time vet is starting his new char. he has the choice to go into the true Legends list to just fight legends. with no mor ap cap or ageing. remmber its there choice. this is where your able to make your own style and have some of your own chowesn stats too. i am sure i have posted this before.

5 time legend league. part two.
you just make a new char as stated before with your own moves and set stats. ageing is part of the game but you have some flexablity to the game by making your own char.

entry into the VOW Legends league.

What do you think? whats needed. there is to many legends and i am sure players know who is the real legends in game if there still here. i have made other posts on this subjenct.

Denzil
Post by: m_carta(37500)
2007-01-21 15:03:08
But for a legends league to work, you actually must have more than just a handful of names. Many of those who have retired multiple times aren't even active in VOW anymore.

And Deadman, the stat cap can be ignored; it's still up to you whether to regard the cap as the main reason to retire. You can still opt for the Terry Funk career and keep going as long as you like.

You also fail to take into account that if the stat cap + aging were removed, at least some of those VWOs who have higher XP than you will not retire. How many of those guys are there, Deadman? Ten? Fifteen? Twenty?

If the stat cap + aging were not implemented in the first place, you would be complaining about how your VWO has no chance against Brian Allan, Jaysen Chambers, Mr. Crappy Pants, Boognish, RVD420, Jason Deal, Dex, The Sniper, tajiri_tarantula, and everyone else who originally had no plans to retire.

Stupendous was right, Deadman. If you want to fight the gods, Joker and the top 10 VWOs are just a challenge click away.
Post by: jmallonee(34807)
2007-01-21 21:52:36
then dont just complain.
if you are going to complain then at least offer something constructive like say this.(whatever it may be) might be a better alternative and here is why.
it is weak to just say this wont work. not even worth the thread space.
Post by: Syrjis(80123)
2007-01-22 06:27:47
Everyone can win anyone. Hell, I even lost to a LAW and got outdamaged while I was a SSWO (low one me thinks). There's a thread about that somewhere in the forums..
Post by: denzil(82151)
2007-01-22 15:39:40
Ok letís do a revamp on this thing.
Part A. The base for a new 5 time legend.
1. Name your own style.
2. Let the players set min and max for the char at the starting level. With in reason.
3. Let the player choose say 5 of his 16 moves.
4. fame will not go below 750


This is the start for all 5 time legends. But then ya get 2 choices.
Part B.
1. The leagues as you know it. With ageing and all the stuff that goes withit. No changes apart from what I stated up top in part .A.

Part C. To set a legends league up. Only 5 time legends may fight.
1. Have some bots for them at the start. A mirror bot with the same stats or the same stats as any other legend. If that legend is online his bot is not... so there are no dodging matches.
2. No ageing.
3. No exp cap.
4. A true legends list for 5 time legends and over. As well as 10000 exp and over too.
5. My favorites. No moaning about your choice. Youíre in this league for life now.
6. When they enter this league you get a potion of youth. It restores your stats back to the non aged ones or not. I donít mind.

I am still thinking about this league. Why I have placed it up there is because so many players whish to keep going but not have the stats of a spwa and be forced to restart. This way itís your choice. I donít know but an exp cap of 20000 might work. You see this was the old problem. But if itís stated now that the cap is 20k. Do you think players would go on to max out there 154 specs. It will not affect any other player bar 5 time legends.

Denzil

Please add to it. Point out bad spots but say how to fix them if you can. Thanks.
Post by: yar(35506)
2007-01-23 00:29:43
Looks good to me:)
Post by: word life 101(66857)
2007-01-23 10:39:26
it would be better if any legend was allowed in there because right now their are two 5 times legends who either dont play anymore or are extremly inactive so the leauge would just be desterted
Post by: BubbaG(33460)
2007-01-23 12:29:14
You mean I could have my very own league????



I might come back for that :)
Post by: The Legend Killer(21778)
2007-01-23 14:39:08
I'll join you in about 7 months :)
Post by: BubbaG(33460)
2007-01-23 15:08:22
Well then I don't want to be in it :O
Post by: tbragu(97303)
2007-01-25 23:22:24
I am not a fan of aging, but never had an issue with a hard and fast stat cap. If there was a true cap, then, there would be a balance, and people could stick around if they chose to. Before the stat cap and aging was brought about, Brain Allan, and probably a few others chose not to retire because they felt that the year plus work they had put in was not worth throwing away for a +1 bonus. It wasn't an ego thing, they just didn't see the point. I always personally felt that retirement was a choice for each player. I always wanted to retire maddogg, and still do. But, I knew others who had no plans to retire, because they fell in love with a style, and at that time, you could only do each style once. Now, that is not an issue anymore, as you can be a tech a million times if you so choose.

I do agree that the legends list needs to be revamped. I haven't counted, but between multiple retirements, and donater's alts, there aren't that many people who have actually retired a character in this game. I think that each character should only be on their once, and each retirement page could post a second, third, and so on retirement.

When I first started, retirement was a big thing, because there wasn't a stat cap, and there wasn't aging. So, people made a sacrifice to retire. Now, it is self-preservation. At some point, your stats will decrease to the point that you will have a million specials, but no stats to speak of.

I still wish there was a comprimise for those that felt that retirement wasn't worth the +1 bonus.
Post by: denzil(82151)
2007-01-26 17:19:07
o o well. it could be called the Bubba league in houner of ya Bubba!

on the char sheet ya could have 5 time legend with styles done down the botem. would have saved a fair few spots. bubba with one entry lk joker and Hick all with one entry? same with mad max and other multapul time legends. it would bring the list to a shourter list for sure. but does it fix the true leggends list up. i dont think so. it trys. but i think its a small patch. some one might count them up to see.

Denzil
Post by: m_carta(37500)
2007-01-27 01:35:57
I'd support a compression of the list, depending on how it's done. I wouldn't support it if the idea is to replace the repeat entries with a footnote to say how many times your wrestler became a Legend; too many of those Legends who have retired multiple times have recorded additional accomplishments to their later Legend profiles. Those achievements deserve to be saved, because they spent so much time (and money) to complete them.

A revamp of the Legend profile could solve this: make it a limitless text field that you can go back to and update each time you retire.

It's only natural that the Legends list seems to have changed in value as more names are added. But you must remember that list is still only filled by the people who are dedicated (or addicted) enough to keep playing till they bought every move.

And I'd credit the list's repeat names more because they know how to get there. While donors have an inherent advantage to quickly reach Legend status, not all of them make it.

But yeah, the retirement reward needs another look, so the people who have become Legends would want another chance to make the list. Give the Legends alternate rewards aside from +1 damage. A small boost to their next style's inherent advantage could work.
Post by: The Mad Hatter(237592)
2007-01-30 15:53:52
I dunno.

I just think it'd be easier that once you buy all the moves you get a screen that pops up with confetti that goes.

'Congrats and whatnot! You can either retire or join the GOD leauge.'

You click retire and you retire and start as a LAW.
You click Join the GOD Leauge and you keep going.
To finally retire when you get bored, just go to legends and hit the 'Enter Legends link'


Don't make it complicated, just simple.
Post by: denzil(82151)
2007-01-30 21:38:53
i think ya right about the legends char sheets. a text box that can be updated by the player is a good idea. how ever getting rid of some of the multapal legends would help. i made my thoughts on the whats going on with vow so not to much more to say realy.

Denzil.
Post by: Dyna Mike Duncan(127082)
2007-02-01 02:15:42
The biggest complaint I've heard in the upper echelons (SSWO + VWO) is the lack of competitive matches available because there are so few SSWO's + VWO's on. I've not had this issue myself in either SSWO or VWO, but there are many people who have stated this. The biggest reason they give for this is the introduction of the age-cap 'forcing' so many of the Legends to retire.
Before the age-cap came in, however, the biggest complaint was from new SSWO's/VWO's who had very little chance in the tournaments because of the VOW Legends like BA etc. dominating them. Without the age-cap, it was practically impossible for anybody to compete with the Legends on a regular basis.
The 'GOD' League sounds like a decent compromise position, but only if it is an OPTIONAL choice not a mandatory requirement. Once all moves are bought, you can either choose to :
a) Play on in VWO, but at the mercy of the age-cap
b) Retire and start again in LAW
c) Join the 'GOD' League and only fight against other GODS of VOW. (Perhaps with the option of Retirement at a later stage)

Option C would have to be refined to stop the BA's of this world from once again dominating the division.

I don't see me signing Dyna Mike Duncan up to a GOD League just yet - I still quite like the process of trying to make him a stronger character second time around. :)
Post by: Dyna Mike Duncan(127082)
2007-02-01 02:58:38
Just amending my option c)

If players choose to join the GOD League, all their stats should be automatically reset to MAX (or, if they've bought all moves before stats are maxed, then they stay at the current level)


Obviously, if they choose to continue in their current league once all moves are bought, Options b) + c) will remain open to them.

And finally, as a possible incentive for Peter to implement a GOD League, how about any donating player who wants to join the GOD League can have an added option of doing both options b) + c) at the same time?

By this, I mean, a donating player could use one of his additional wrestlers as their retired star AS WELL AS having him in the GOD League. So, Dyna Mike Duncan could be in the GOD League AND Dyna Mike Duncan 2 could start in LAW with the Legend Bonus :)
Post by: The Mad Hatter(237592)
2007-02-01 12:42:05
Excellent ideas DND. I really think that should be implemented.
Post by: m_carta(37500)
2007-02-02 01:11:32
Just amending my option c)

If players choose to join the GOD League, all their stats should be automatically reset to MAX (or, if they've bought all moves before stats are maxed, then they stay at the current level)


Obviously, if they choose to continue in their current league once all moves are bought, Options b) + c) will remain open to them.

And finally, as a possible incentive for Peter to implement a GOD League, how about any donating player who wants to join the GOD League can have an added option of doing both options b) + c) at the same time?

By this, I mean, a donating player could use one of his additional wrestlers as their retired star AS WELL AS having him in the GOD League. So, Dyna Mike Duncan could be in the GOD League AND Dyna Mike Duncan 2 could start in LAW with the Legend Bonus :)
-----

Retiring to build your character becomes useless when you can just build your stats to infinity.

Like what Captain Stupendous said:
The introduction of the stat cap and aging protected the balance of the game and prevented people from being selfish. What other reason would drive people to want limitless power aside from SELFISHNESS?


Post by: Dyna Mike Duncan(127082)
2007-02-02 03:12:50
There should still be a stat cap in my opinion, to stop GODS from building their stats to infinity, but in the GOD League, there would be no ageing to reduces those stats. Eventually, you will end up with a load of GODS with all their moves specialised and tons of cash in the bank (which I'd find really boring personally)
The Selfishness accusation could be a valid one, but as the only people 'selfish' gods could fight would be other 'selfish' gods (because GODS wouldn't be allowed to challenge non-GODS) or those VWO's etc daft enough to challenge them, then where's the harm?
The GOD league would be a purely VOLUNTARY decision - if you don't like the idea, you don't have to join. Fairly straightforward solution :)
Post by: m_carta(37500)
2007-02-02 03:35:16
You haven't sold me on the concept. The very idea of being labeled a "god" means you can and will exercise your might on everyone else. There is no purpose having a "god" league if you're unable to actually flex your muscle, know what I mean?

And suggesting that you be allowed to have Dyna Mike run wild in the God league and run wild in the lower leagues as a LAW reeks of having your cake and eating it. That kills the argument about your suggestion not reeking of self-interest. You're already in a good position to benefit from such a change, were it to happen.
Post by: Dyna Mike Duncan(127082)
2007-02-02 21:43:12
Firstly - I doubt I'd join the GOD league anyway (as I said earlier) as I like the process of building a character up and fighting the same people day in/day out would get boring.

And to summarise my points again.

The stat-cap + ageing were brought in because of complaints about the major players dominating the upper divisions. This was thought to be putting people off from advancing to SSWO/VWO.

Since ageing was brought in, a lot of the major players have since left, causing more complaints.

A compromise position would seem to be to create a 'GOD' League which would be voluntary to join when all moves had been bought. GODS would not be allowed to challenge any other league, would still have a maximum level for their stats, but no age-ing effect. Other leagues could challenge GODS if they so wish.

I don't see the harm in this to the game. LAW through VWO would continue as it currently does so. Age-ing would still be in force in VWO and it would be a personal choice whether or not to join the GODS or retire and start over.

This would solve the complaints from lower leagues about a few people dominating the upper division AND give the Legends the chance to play on with the characters they have spent so long developing.

I see your point of having your cake + eating it - this was just a suggestion to influence more people to donate really.
Post by: Syrjis(80123)
2007-02-03 08:20:33
"Option C would have to be refined to stop the BA's of this world from once again dominating the division."

FYI, BA didn't dominate the division. If he would have, noone would have had any wins over him.. Technically.
Post by: yar(35506)
2007-02-04 12:37:54
I have noticed that alot of people who talk about BA, here and in vow, wasnt even around when he was playing regularily.
BA was at best just an average wrestler till he refused to retire and jumped so far ahead of people with his experience and specials.
A reputation dies hard i guess. And what BA did only affected a small% of VOW anyway, those in VWO.
And now instead of being afraid of BA, they are afraid of the stat cap and aging. Which I might add is not a big deal anyway. Anytime you fear something, you allow that fear to control you, this is just a game, a very fun game, but still just a game. Leave fear in the real world, and just play and have fun. Like me:)
( I am not slamming BA he was a good competitor, just not the god so many people try to make him into.)
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